Welcome back to the Discount Property Investor podcast. Our mission is to share what we have learned from our experience and the experience of others to help you make more money investing like a pro. We want to teach you how to create wealth by investing in real estate, the discount property investor way. To jumpstart your real estate investing career, visit freewholesalecourse.com, the most complete free course on wholesaling real estate ever. Thanks for tuning in.

David: Hey guys, welcome back to the discount property investor podcast. I am your host David Dodge, my co-host Mike Slane had a baby yesterday or the day before, so he is actually going to be out for 2 or 3 weeks. Newest member of his family, he had a little son, his name is Max. Super excited for Mike. Again, he will be back in a couple weeks. Today, I have a special guest, a personal friend and I've known Chris Craddock, my guest for I guess going on 3 years at this point now?

Chris: Yeah.

David: Give or take. Eh, give or take. And Chris is the man. I have really, really enjoyed knowing Chris. He constantly is you know, bringing to light new products and new things that can help us in our business, so I always love talking with Chris and networking with Chris. And in fact Chris and I, about a year-and-a-half ago, went down to a little town in Texas right outside of San Antonio and we got to drive tanks. It was such a cool experience, such a cool experience, shot a flame thrower.

Chris: Bro I just posted to a bunch of my buddies the tank stuff and then you standing there with a flamethrower, with a 25 foot flamethrower. That was crazy.

David: Yes, yes. Drive tanks, flamethrowers, machine guns, you name it, such a cool cool experience. And right before we started this show, Chris said are you going to come fly fighter jets with me in September and I said, hell yeah I'm going to fly fighter jets with you. So we also share a need for speed and the adrenaline rush and that's why I like Chris so much, we get along great but Chris is here today to talk about REI Revive, and Chris has actually done some private coaching with me in the past on this very topic and he has an amazing coaching program and essentially I'm going to let him explain it to you guys today, but it's an amazing program because he specializes in something that is so unique and that is turning your leads that some people, most people would say, you know, would often just throw away and consider those leads to be you know, trash into you know, profit generating leads. It's got a really, really cool strategy so Chris, thanks for joining me, I'm grateful to have you on the show and I'm grateful for your time. Welcome my friend.

Chris: Hey, I am so excited to be here and yeah, that's one of the things that I love about my boy David Dodge is anytime there's fun to be had, I know he's going to be there.

David: I'm ready.

Chris: All right, I love- whenever I teach sales, I'm a disc profile guy and so you know, I'm a massive like D, like driven, driving but also a massive I on the disc profile and I think that whole like, the I, the interpersonal side of the disc profile, David Dodge, double D and I, you know, bro's just wanna hang out and have fun, and then you know, that D side, going- make a lot of money and build some big stuff but then have fun too. Work hard, play0 hard. I love that.

David: That's right. Work hard, play hard man. That's exactly right.

Chris: Anyway but yeah, I'm so excited to be here and yeah, I mean my story, you know, I've got what? It's 11 businesses now, all in the real estate world. My biggest one is my retail team. We did- I guess we're going to do almost 6 million dollars in commissions this year and so yeah, just build that up. We also got title, my wife runs a lending business, we got insurance, we got construction, like just there's just all- LegalShield, like all these different businesses in the construction- in the real estate world, but I also got this coaching business where essentially what we do is, if you are an investor, what happens is, if you- let's say you're sending out direct mail or let's say you cold call or voicemail drop, you get 20 people that say yes, I want to sell my property. You're going to find maybe four of them that don't want to sell at a massive discount. [inaudible]-

David: Yeah, probably less than that, probably one o two really.

Chris: Right., right , right, right. And then you find one that said yes, but what about those other 19, right? Like you sign up one, what happens to the other 19? Another agent? Another investor? Somebody else gets paid on it, but it's not you. So what we've learned is I call it upside down wholesaling, right? It's a way to make money on the leads that you've just been throwing away. So, that's that whole thing is like I mean, how many leads do you throw away? How many leads are in there? And I'll tell you, I have brand-new wholesalers that I have trained that I have worked with are making 10 to 15 thousand dollars a month on deals where they haven't even done that much a month in their wholesaling business and they're making that on deals that that's- that they're upside down wholesaling, and then you see I've got a massive wholesaler that I'm in business with, my personal retail team that we built this out with and literally, we're averaging sending him over $60,000 a month. So he is-  he's averaging three quarters of a million dollars a year in revenue from leads that were just sitting dead in the CRM. So that's kind of our deal man, it's been awesome, it's been crazy.

David: Man that is awesome, that is really awesome. So how are people able to, you know, if they- basically if they have never heard of you know, this particular strategy, can you do me a favor and break it down in terms of some of the simple steps that people can take and then obviously I want to know more about you know, your program cuz I know you have students that you're meeting with you know, on a weekly schedule and you know, helping those people as well, but basically how can somebody go about you know, turning a lead that they would you know, normally not make any money off of like you said, you get 20 or 30 leads, I mean really in theory like one of those maybe a deal right away, you know, like one of them, maybe two. Now, if you work those leads for 4 to 6 or 8 months, hopefully 4 to 6 of those will turn into deals, right?

Chris: Yeah.

David: But right away out the gate, you know, typically 1 in 30 is going to lead to something, you know? The time is your friend when you are an investor, don't forget that guys. You have to put leads in your system and you have to nourish those leads. You got to give them attention and follow up, that's super, super important, but Chris, I want to learn some of the strategies that you're using at this point to turn some of these leads that you know, that may be dead leads and they may be dead leads today, they may be dead leads in eight months from now, you know how are you able to turn those into cash?

Chris: Yeah, so here's my- here's the first thing, I'll tell you like- now, if you don't have the whole system put together then you know, having a bunch of people that raise their hand and say yes I'm ready, doesn't work but you go to your CRM, let's say- dude what do you think your average listener would have in their CRM as far as leads from the last you know, let's say 2 years?

David: I don't know, maybe a thousand.

Chris: All right, so I had actually a wholesaler in our area not too long ago that had 860 leads, right? That they just were just sitting in there, so we sent this text to it like just mass text to all the leads in their database and said hi and then it auto-populated their name, are you still looking to sell your property if you got the right price for it? We set 29 retail appointments from that, 29 literally and then just think about that. In an average market, let's just say 250 thousand dollar average market, if you're setting 29 appointments, how many of those turn into deals and how much money is that right there just being left on the table? We're talking about tens of thousands of dollars that is just sitting there dying. So one of my favorite analogies is this: so these sawmills, they used to- like they we're just barely profitable and sadly I know, I mean David, I know you and I both know so many investors that are working hard trying to make ends meet but they're just barely profitable, right? And I think, you know, when you- when I talk to people all across the country, I see that over and over and over again and they're just trying to the cross that bridge into profitability, right? And so what happened was one of them got this idea that the byproduct, the stuff they were throwing away, the sawdust in these sawmills that they can repurpose. They could sell it for fuel where people can burn it in their factories, where people could compress it and make a particle board, you know, just all the different things you can do with sawdust and they started selling it. And so they went from taking the stuff they were throwing away to making almost as much money on the sawdust as they were on the wood that they were milling and all of a sudden they went to being just barely getting by profitability wise to making a fortune. And so that's what we're- what we have done here because everybody here, all the investors are looking, they're looking everywhere to find sellers that are willing to sell. Well, you've got a lot of people that are willing to sell and you can monetize those leads, only the problem is most of them, they just sit and die in your CRM and somebody else makes money on it.

David: Yeah, that is the truth man, that is the truth. If you are not you know, giving them multiple options, somebody else is going to come in and they will do that. I love it. So what would be your advice to somebody that you know, has a small operation, you know and let's say they've been in business for one or two years and they had 500 to 1000 leads and they're not an agent though, right? If they are an agent then they could go do the marketing to those existing leads or another way to say that would be to just reach out to them in some way, shape or form and ask them if they're interested in selling it and then setting appointments obviously for themself or their team but if they don't- if they aren't an agent, you know, I'm sure you have some strategies that you can help, you know, for that route.

Chris: Yeah, so if you are an agent, what'd I say, it just makes it easy because you can get referral fees and everything else. And I'll tell you, I don't think agents- a lot of times this is a problem, if you were an agent as well and you try to pivot over to the listing, you're like hey yeah, I can buy your house in cash for 115 thousand and they say no and they're like oh by the way, I could also list it for 250 thousand. You're not gonna pivot well, you need to have a hand off because somebody- they're just gonna look at you and be like yeah I don't know about you, like are you kidding me? Like- and you've lost all rapport. So that's why you need a partner and what you're looking for is an agent that is happy, hungry, humble and smart, right? That's it. Like if they're not happy, they're going to look at the splits that you have and they're going to be really annoyed. If they're not hungry, they're jut going to sit on their ouch and they're not gonna work, they're not going to work your deals like you work your deals. If they're not humble, they're not going to follow your system, they're not gonna listen, they're not going to be growing, you know your business grows, it's like you grow, and if you're not humble, you don't grow and if you're not smart which is not just you know, high IQ you know, high SAT scores and all that but also EQ, you know, how do you deal with people? And also here's the other thing, I've got a you know, a principle that we have for my family and for all my businesses that we're quick learners, right? Keith Cunningham in the in the book, he wrote about stupid. He talks about paying a stupid tax, right? So smart is also not being stupid, right? You don't make the same mistakes over and over and over again. When you walk in and somebody wants to sell and they don't sign an agreement with you, you got to figure out what did you do wrong? Don't blame the seller, don't blame some other agent, don't blame anybody else, blame yourself and just say if I had groundhog day and I could had this appointment a hundred times over and over and over again until I got it right, could I have gotten it right? And the reality is most of the time it's yes and then you say, what did I do wrong and how can I learn so I don't make the same stupid mistake over and over again and pay the stupid tax?

David: I love it man. You're absolutely right. I love that, love it. So, bring in a partner that's an agent in the event that you are not. If you are an agent, then there's a couple different strategies, right? Essentially you are just going to find somebody to partner with, you know, that's maybe not in your business because you don't necessarily have to do that if you're an agent, you can do what's called get a referral fee. So if you're unaware of what that is guys, if you are an agent and somebody coming to you as a- you know, wanting to list their property and/or buy a property and they need representation, you can refer them to another agent at a rate, like you can say I want 25% or I want 35% of any money that you make from this customer, right? And you don't- you can't really do that in a lot of industries but in the real estate brokerage business, you can and you can essentially- you know, and I think one thing you had mentioned earlier that I want a circle back on just for a second was you need to have a hand off. That's very important, you know, if I go in and I offer somebody 110 grand for their property and you know, and they're asking 200, and then I turn around and I say yeah you know, we might be able to get that 200 if you list it, but you should sell it to me for 110, they're going to be like no you're crazy, right? And then they're not going to want to work with that person. It's just you kind of burnt that bridge at that point.

Chris: Yeah.

David: So having that hand off I think is very, very important because you know, if you want to be the guy making the low offer as the investor, that's great, be that guy, but hand it off to somebody else that can come in behind you as your partner and they can essentially say yeah that guys offer's crazy, you know if you need to sell it next Tuesday though, he's a great option, but we don't need to sell next Tuesday, we got a couple weeks or a couple months, let's get you a higher number and then boom, now they're the good guy and you're- you know, good cop, bad cop for the most part and sometimes they will come back and they will take that offer, but most of the time, whenever somebody sells a piece of real estate, it's not a time intensive process and they just want to get the most money. They would rather pay the mortgage for 2 or 3 or 6 months in some cases to get an extra 40 or 50 thousand dollars for the property, right? So Chris, I love that man.

Chris: 100%, and the crazy thing is, I mean, talking about the agent side of the business real quick before we get back into the other thing. You know, success leaves clues and I'll tell you, a lot of times people are so opposed to getting their license in- your real estate license., and I'll tell you, you don't necessarily do it because you're going to do all of the pieces there, but I- I'm the biggest proponent of every- like every organization should have somebody licensed in their organization, and success leaves clues. Every big real estate operation, wholesaling, fix and flip, they have somebody licensed in their organization. David, I know you're not licensed but your business partner is so you're technically- you're organization is licensed. [inaudible].

David: Yeah, absolutely we are. Absolutely yeah yeah. And I give a lot of leads to my team that are licensed, you know, that- so like some of the things that we do is you know, we use this as a tool to help our team members make extra money on the side, you know, and some businesses would want that referral, we still get a piece of it from being the broker, right? And you know, some leads though we will send out to a third-party, somebody that we know who'll really be able to help that seller, right? Other times we'll keep it within our own organization and pass it up to a licensed agent and let them go earn the commission because you know, we may not you know, have paid them a whole lot recently or whatever so, just an added bonus that we're spending money on the marketing, we're generating the leads. Our core business is buying properties to rent out or to fix and flip. We wholesale a ton of properties that are just extra and the leads that we can't wholesale, we can't buy to fix and flip, we can't buy to rent out, it's typically because we're not agreeing on price. I mean that is usually the reason, not always but usually and then from there what we do is we'll say hey you know, maybe we should hand this off like we talked about, to somebody else on the team that's not going to come in with a low offer and maybe they're willing to go talk to that seller and see if they're able to get a listing out of it and that listing may or may not sell, but if you don't try the answer's always no, right? And it's- it is such a great you know, just way to- I look at it like this: it's another tool in the belt, right?

Chris: Yeah.

David: If you show up to do a roof and all you got is a screwdriver, you're not going to get too far man, right? You have to have the right tools to do the right job, right? And by having this tool in your belt, it's going to make your business more money. That's just the way it is.

Chris: The key here is every time the phone rings, you should be able to get paid, right? There's the soundbite, there's the click, every time the phone rings, you should get paid, and right now, you have one tool. If you only wholesale or you only fix and flip, you got one- you've got a screwdriver and you're not going to get that roof on, right? Like that's the deal, you should be able to get paid. And so here's the other side of it: most people, and I want to answer this question, most people are like oh that's easy, right? Then I just get this kicking over to an agent and then I'm done. I'll tell you, this is where- this is why I have this program that I talk about and this is the difference here so me personally, I'll just tell you, I spent over 6 figures every year on coaching, like on coaching, right? And mastermind groups and being able to hang out with guys like David, right? Where David I mean, when we were- I'll just- I'll share this. We were hanging out after we went shooting, sitting around a bonfire at a pool in San Antonio and or whatever that little town is right outside and we were all going around talking about the things that are going on in our business and one of the things I said is man, I'm interviewing people all day every day and it sucks the life out of me. I hate interviewing people, I'm not good at it, I don't enjoy it, it's just the work and I'll tell you, our friend Chris Arnold was like, why don't you hire a recruiter? And I was like, well I- uh-. He's like well that sounds stupid, why don't you hire a recruiter? And I'm like well- And then literally like the next day, I get back and our friend like Lars who also were in our same mastermind said the same thing to me like you- like we were just talking about like hey and he's like why don't you hire a recruiter? So I hear from 2 friends that I'm involved with because I pay to be a part of these groups- these organizations, right? Like that's it, like I pay to be with people that know their stuff and honestly, probably the biggest change in my whole organization over the last year was I hired a recruiter and I don't have to interview people all day everyday anymore and I've added so much talent to my organization. So I go back to this other thing where you say: well, all you gotta do is just get a real estate agent, well I'll tell you what, you look across the board and every- like so many of the big organizations, they're like yeah I do this but I make no money on it. The organization that we sent three quarters of a million dollars to every year, when I first met them, they were like Chris look, we had our own brokerage at one point in time, we send all these out to everybody. We've tried all of these different things and it just- we've lost  money or time every time we focused on it because we never make any money. In fact, we have one of the top agents in the world right now that we've given a thousand leads to over the last six months and she's closed 6 deals, and like it's not worth our time and I just kept calling because I believe persistence breaks resistance, right? Like if you're in sales, persistence breaks resistance. So I kept calling and calling, and I think I built rapport, I think I'm a pretty nice guy so they didn't want to like just be like stop calling us, and so eventually, they gave me 150 leads. I'm like just give me some leads, give me some of these deals, let me show you how you monetize it. They gave me 150 leads, 70 of them are already sold to somebody, 30 of them were out of my are and there was like 40 leads left so- if that math is right, but I have 40 leads and I was like okay, I gotta get 6 deals done because this other person got 6 done with a thousand. I got to get 6 done with more. I ended up closing, I got 6 under contract, 6 listings signed on the market that I was going to be sending this group money and I call him up I say hey I got 6 signed and they're like what? They're like Chris, why don't you come in the office? So I come in to the office like hey and this was early on in my career so they didn't know me, I didn't know them very well except I knew they were really big. I go in, they're like Chris, we liked you so we didn't want to tell you to like screw off but here's the deal, we wanted to just like get you to stop bugging us so we gave you 150 leads that I told them to get like leads that were like 5 years old so that you would like hit a brick wall and just leave us alone and stop calling us every week and be like hey let's work together, and he's like you closed 6? Let's work this out and literally since then, we got to the point where we're literally closing and I'm sending them over $60,000 a month every month on deals, like just think about that. I don't care how big your organization is, if you got three quarters of a million dollar in net profit that you've already paid for sitting in your database every single year, that changes your life and so, how about let's just bring it back down to scale, right? Let's say you don't have three quarters of a million but if you have $10,000 a month that just comes back in your organization that you're already paying for that's sitting there as trash, it changes your life and so, everybody's like oh, I'll just figure it out, I'll figure it out. Well for me personally, I pay money for speed and that's why you know, I've got this coaching business and so many people have said I'll figure it out myself, I'll figure it out myself and the reality is I pay other people get me there faster, and if you commit $10,000 a month, like you can figure it out but maybe it takes you a year. How much does that cost you every month in a year?

David: Yeah, that's a great point.

Chris: Pay for coaching, like don't just pay for mine, and if you don't have coaching in other places, I don't know David, David, I know you have some free coaching, I know you have some paid coaching. Find people that are good at what they do, pay for coaching. I do it, I'm not telling you this as somebody that doesn't do it.

David: Oh yeah, I spend 6 figures every year doing- paying for coaching too man, being in groups and going on trips to meet people and signing up for courses and jumping on Zoom calls and there's some people that I pay hourly just to chat with, right? So yeah, coaching, I'm a huge proponent, huge fan of coaching.

Chris: Yeah, and so that's the whole thing there. You could figure it out on your own in- and if it- let's just say it takes you 5 months to get where you'd be in 1 month, right? Well how much money did that cost you, right? And it goes back to this idea. I'm curious Dave, if you could- if I could bottle up what you know, like all of the knowledge inside of your head and give you a pill where you could go back 5 years from today and you'd know everything you know today 5 years ago, like everything, how much you'd think you'd pay for that pill?

David: Oh man, it would be quite a pretty penny man. I'd say yeah, couple hundred grand probably.

Chris: I mean, at least right? I mean I think my number is in the millions, right?

David: Yeah.

Chris: Because you think about how, like if you know what you know today, like my guess is if you actually sat down and thought about all the mistakes and all the things that you had to figure out over the last 5 years like, I mean-

David: Yeah, I'd probably be in the mid- probably be in the millions, you're right. I mean, if you think about all the stuff. 5 years is a long time, that's a really long time.

Chris: And see, that's the whole thing. If I can- lets say, I hire you as a coach David, like if I can learn everything that you know now and basically compress all of that information into a short period of time and basically implement that, how much is that worth to me, right?

David: Oh yeah, absolutely. It's worth a fortune.

Chris: That's why I pay to be in these masterminds, right? I'm in a number of masterminds because just sitting there around that fire literally made me definitely over a hundred grand this year, maybe a couple hundred grand this year just by making that one hire there, so a lot of people are like oh I'll figure it out myself. I'll tell you you're paying a stupid tax right there, like learn to compre- Tony Robbins says compress the decades of knowledge into days, right? Like learn to have the path instead of making the mistake, there's too much money to be made in this business to try to figure it out. That's foolishness, it's not wisdom, it's foolishness. So- and I say that as somebody that obviously, I've got an axe to grind cuz I'm saying, hey my course is going to make you a lot of money and so people pay the money to be a part of this course that will make a lot of money, but I also say that as somebody that's spend over $100,000 every year to learn faster and be around other people that are very, very smart people.

David: Man. I love it. Chris, where would somebody go to find out more about the course?

Chris: So chriscraddock.com, just my name. You know, chriscraddock.com, C-H-R-I-S-C-R-A-D-D-O-C-K.com, you know, my Instagram, basically people were so generous with me. I still remember the first time you and I met, like I was- our friend Chris who actually was the one telling me to stop being an idiot and hire a recruiter, but our friend Chris you know, set us up and you know, and it was awesome like we just got to know each other on that call, everything there but you were giving me a lot of information that I didn't know because I know you're big into the BRRRR you know, the BRRRR method which I'd never done any BRRRR stuff so Chris set us up and I just was able to give you a call. So I try to give back like people have been generous with me and so if you seek me out, find me on Instagram @craddrock, C-R-A-D-D-R-O-C-K. I reply to every DM, now I'm getting more and more people hitting me up as I'm making that offer so sometimes it's not within 24 hours, but I will reply I promise.

David: Yeah, yeah, that's alright. Social media, yeah yeah yeah, totally get that.

Chris: I will reply I promise but yeah. And even if you're thinking about becoming an agent, you know I'll tell you, that's one of the other things is teaching you how to become an agent and how to use that well, I'd be happy to steer you in the right direction on that front too but yeah reach out at chriscraddock.com or you know, DM me on Instagram. And if you are an agent and an investor, I also have a podcast, obviously you want to listen to this podcast, but I've read this study that says the average podcast listener listens to 7 podcasts and so obviously this should be one of them and I'd love to be one of your other seven, it's called Uncommon Real Estate and I should- David Dodge has been on here talking about BRRRR and everything else so yeah, and that's, it's geared towards the agent/investor.

David: Yeah, great- you guys have a great show over there. I like Uncommon Real Estate, it's a great podcast.

Chris: Yeah, so that's the deal. I'll tell you guys, I mean that's what I can offer. I hope I'm not too blunt and too in your face on that because I- you know, I just- I just really believe that it's huge and I think that a lot of people are never going to reach the true potential they have because they're being cheap and they're afraid to spend a little bit of money to have somebody teach them how to get there faster.

David: I agree Chris, 100% man, a hundred percent. Having this tool on your belt guys is only going to make you more money. Chris is an expert on teaching you how to turn your trash leads into cash, right? And there's lots of different ways. It doesn't matter if you're licensed or not. He and I both encourage you to go get licensed or partner with somebody that is, right? So you can take advantage of you know, of the referral fees and if not, you can basically, you can run your own appointments with those guys, but again, you have a lot of money sitting in your CRM and Chris specializes on teaching people how to cash out man, how to take those leads that you know, it doesn't matter if that's leads been in the system for 2 weeks or 2 years and in some cases 5, 6, 7 years, right? They at one point raised their hand and if you are an investor, specifically a wholesaler, you're making really really low offers, right? Well that may not work for people but there are still other options man, I absolutely love it. Chris, thank you so much for coming on the show today. Guys, don't forget you can connect with Chris over on Instagram, his handle is @craddrock and that's C-R-A-D-D-O-C-K.

Chris: Actually, craddrock, C-R-A-D-D-R-O-C-K. It's an old high school nickname, I should probably change it.

David: Oh got it. Okay, craddrock. Thank you for correcting me on that. It's going to be added to the show notes as well guys and then of course, Chris Craddock is his name.com, and that one is C-R-A-D-D-O-C-K to learn more about his coaching program and the course that Chris offers. Chris, again thanks so much for coming on. I can't wait to go fly fighter jets with you in about I don't know, maybe 5 or 6 weeks from now.

Chris: Yup.

David: It's going to be an awesome time and again, we're going to get to sit around a fire by a pool most likely and talk about each others businesses and see how we can help each other and that's what it's all about. I love it. Chris, any parting words for the audience?

Chris: Yeah, just guys, activity and skill, right? Talk to more people, you're going to win if you do enough activity and skill, do anything you can to level up, to grow faster, to get better as fast as you can. Activity and skill, that's what wins the day.

David: Man I love that, activity- I'm taking that, I'm stealing that for sure. Activity and skill. Chris, thanks for coming on the show today, as always, much appreciated, super grateful to have you on the show and grateful for your time. We will see you next time. Signing off.

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