Welcome back to the Discount Property Investor podcast. Our mission is to share what we have learned from our experience and the experience of others to help you make more money investing like a pro. We want to teach you how to create wealth by investing in real estate, the discount property investor way. To jumpstart your real estate investing career, visit freewholesalecourse.com, the most complete free course on wholesaling real estate ever. Thanks for tuning in.

David Dodge: Alright guys welcome back to the discount property investor podcast, I am your host David Dodge. My partner Mike is in the field as usual, he's always out in the field helping us find that next rental property, running appointments, and finding us those good wholesale deals but today I am joined by a special guest, a friend, David Olds, and David is doing amazing things so I'm really really happy to get David on. David and I align very well, we both love the landlording business and the passive income that it creates and the tax benefits from the depreciation and all things considered but I really like David because not only is he in the landlording game, he also does a ton of wholesaling guys and he's in multiple states. So just a quick intro before I bring David on, David is a full time real estate investor and he is based out of Chattanooga TN which is basically kind of one of my neighbors so you're out of Saint Louis MO here, and he started investing back in 2002, guys I started in 2004 so we've been in the game for quite some time together and when he started back in 2002, he and his wife bought their first home and that was unknowingly a foreclosure but after flipping that property for a $50,000 profit, they discovered the world of real estate investing and he went on to do numerous flips in Central Florida before the crash of 08 and 09, right? And struggling to find these deals, they ended up relocating to Chattanooga where he is at today to work a new market and there through hard work and you know, sheer determination became the dominant wholesaler in the region. So if you're listening and you're in Chattanooga or in the area, you need to connect with David here. Along the way he accumulated 70 rental properties, he's crushing it and he continued to flip, mastering not only wholesaling but property management as well as raising private capital and we all know private capital is the key to success if we are going to be using the BRRRR method or buying rentals and using little to none of our own money which I love it. Now David is a sought after speaker and coach who is thriving nationwide with his wholesaling company and he continues to grow his rental portfolio while teaching the next generation of investors the tips and secrets that need to rapidly grow their businesses, right? And to get their desired income level and lifestyle. I love that because we all get into real estate because we want one of two things typically, not always but typically. We want time freedom and we want passive income or financial freedom and it's really sad because a lot of people, they get into this business for these two things and they find that they have neither, right? Don't let your business you know, don't be a slave to your business, right? So David is gonna give us some really really awesome tips and tricks. Some of David's guiding principles are simplicity is scalable, I love this, I love this, and always start with the end in mind and a lot of people don't do that so guys we're gonna come back to these and it's the common sense approach to a business that has enabled David to build a strong business with such an amazing team. David, without further ado, welcome man, how are you?

David Olds: That's a lot of stuff.

David Dodge: Hahaha I know but you're an impressive guy.

David Olds: I don't know about all that, I'm just a regular guy like everybody else.

David Dodge: I like it. Man hey thanks for coming on the show, so our audience is you know newbie investors, some- you know some guys are doing landlording, some guys are doing BRRRR method, some guys are doing wholesaling, we talk a little bit about fix and flip but for the most part you know one thing I like to really drill in on these episodes is mindset. Mindset is like really kind of where it all starts and ends, and you know you had just- or you know, I had just stated always start with the end in mind, right? And it starts and ends with mindset. So again, welcome man, what is going on? How are you? What is new?

David Olds: Busy today, we're locking up deals, our girls just locked up one down in Daytona Florida to an end buyer that's gonna net us 55,000 so that's always a nice way to start your morning before lunch.

David Dodge: Hell yeah.

David Olds: So yeah that's good. Yeah man you know you talk about mindset, people having that dream right? Everybody gets into real estate for the same reason, most of us read 'Rich Dad, Poor Dad' and you know, we have this- I don't wanna say fantasy but this projected goal, right? Of having that life where you can sit on a beach if you want and just collect that check every month. So it's really important and I stress this with everybody that I talk to, I had some college kids in here the other day that kind of intern for us or mentoring a little bit and I was- I asked one of the girls a question: for you what does the end look like? And you know, she's 20 I mean sharp but 20 and you know she kind of fumbled with it and I asked it again like what does the end look? Three times I usually will ask and try to get some answers from them and I'll usually put it a different way, if you had all the money you needed today, what would your life look like? And that usually gets it a little bit closer and you know generally they'll say travel, some people will say like opening a nonprofit in Africa, you know whatever it is, whatever it is that is their goal and I say well that's fantastic, so what does it take to get you there, right? Like what does- what does that actually look like if you wanna sit on the beach in Saint Thomas every day of your life forever and sip margaritas or mai tai's or whatever it is that they drink down there, and then we try to put a number on it, right?

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: And generally people think it's this like I gotta have 10 million dollars in the bank and that's not true. You know, what would it cost you every month to live that lifestyle that you want and maybe have 20, 25% extra? And I'll be honest like most normal people can do it for 20 or 25 grand a month like you know, some people like I want- they set these crazy goals, I want $400,000 a month passive income and that's awesome but start with you know, start with a number that makes sense that you can wrap your head around. Okay I need to have rent, mortgage, you know, food expenses, you know, and generally for a normal person that's 20 or 25 thousand a month and I say well fantastic let's work that backwards, right? How many rentals would it take for you to produce that kind of income?

David Dodge: A normal person spends 25 thousand a month?

David Olds: I mean mine is a little bit high- not higher but I'm [inaudible].

David Dodge: I think a normal person's probably spending somewhere between 4 and 6, you gotta think, you know mortgage, car payment, they gotta eat.

David Olds: [inaudible].

David Dodge: Gotta get clothes, you know but you know maybe a little higher, you know let's say 7 or 8.

David Olds: Yeah maybe that's the financially free number. I'm like tell me your dreams.

David Dodge: Yeah okay I like it, there you go. What's the dream number, right?

David Olds: Tell me your dream and I'm gonna show you how you can get there.

David Dodge: Got it.

David Olds: It's not hard, you know?

David Dodge: Okay

David Olds: So with Olivia, we sat down the other day and this was I think Friday afternoon, I actually had Corey Geary in my office and I love whiteboards man.

David Dodge: Corey's a great [inaudible].

David Olds: He's awesome. My employees they can tell when I'm like getting sketchy and I'm like going to the whiteboard to draw and I'm like okay great so 20,000. So let's say you need rentals that are 800 a month so how many is that? Right? So you need 24, 25 rentals. Awesome, how do we do that? How can we get you there? So we just- we just work that math backwards and she's like oh that's not really that much. I'm like it's absolutely not. So if you bought one rental a year, you're 20 right? Cause I know she's not old enough to drink yet so if you bought one rental a year for the next 25 years, you're done, now you're done at 45 like does that make sense? Yeah absolutely. But what if you bought 2 a year? Now you're done at 12 and she's like well yeah I could do that and I said what if you bought 3 or 4? I said I have friends who bought 100 units this year, you could definitely do it in one year and you're done, right?

David Dodge: I've got about like 46 already this year.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: So you know, start with the end in mind and then once you have your plan, you know, let's look at how can we compress that time and do it a little bit faster, right? Cause that's the goal, right? What does the end look like? How quickly can I get to the end? You know? And that doesn't mean you know, you're sitting under an umbrella someplace, you know for me I still want to be involved in real estate but I do want to get to a place where you know, my family is good and they're good forever but anyways start with the end in mind.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: A long way to go for that little explanation.

David Dodge: No I think that's a great- that's a great place to start, literally start with the end in mind, right? Work it backwards, also you know, what are you trying to achieve? Are you trying to achieve time freedom or are you trying to achieve financial freedom? I wanted both, I have both, right? Now I've been at this full time for 7 years and it shouldn't necessarily take you 7 years, I did a lot of things the wrong way. Now that's full time, I've been investing since I think probably 04, call it 05, so about almost as long as you. You got me by a couple years here. But the 1st 10 years I did it wrong man, I was buying one a year, I was going to the MLS with an agent, paying full retail, getting an 80% conventional loan and my house- my average price point was 150 grand so that means if I'm bringing 20% to the table, that's $30,000 per rental property that I would need to save up and you know, basically it would be- it equaled out to about one a year. So the first 10 years David, I got to about you know maybe about 11 or 12 properties, right? But the last 7, you know, I learned about motivated sellers and I didn't even know wholesaling was a thing 7 years ago, I learned it and I started wholesaling and we've done tons and tons, hundreds of deals and at this point now I like to cherry pick these best deals and add them to the rental portfolio or sometimes they're just fun fix and flips, so we do some of them as well here too. But what I'm getting at, why am I telling you all this? Because I agree with everything you just said, love it love it.

David Olds: Yeah but even when we say we made mistakes and you're telling me about all these mistakes, like think of what you accomplished right? How many people have no properties that wish they had 10 or 12?

David Dodge: Oh yeah.

David Olds: And even though you did that over the course of 10 years and you did have to put some money down, okay I get it that's not ideal but now where are those properties, right? What kind of equity do you have in those properties now? I bet you 50 or 60% unless you've refied and pulled out money for something else. So you created that strong base, you learned how to do it and you took action, that was the most important thing.

David Dodge: Yup. Oh the ones that I started with man, you're right like yeah I'd say 60% ish is equity, right?

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: So less than half of debt, it's great. Yeah.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: Love it.

David Olds: I had a client one time in San Jose just outside of San Francisco and we went to this meet up real estate group probably 8-9 years ago when I was traveling a lot and there's this old guy that was talking to this group and somebody asked him about you know, paying too much on a rental and he said listen if it cash flows you know, whatever your financing is, however you're doing this, if you have cash flow, in the long term it's going to pay for you even if you paid 100% because in time as long as that- your financing or funding is stable, rents are gonna go up overtime and we- I've seen that here in town, I have duplexes that when I bought them they were renting 400 a month now they're at 950 and if I just remodel them a little bit I'd jump to 1300. So you know, that rent is going to rise because of inflation and all that stuff. In the long term and real estate is a long term game, you're gonna come out just fine.

David Dodge: Man I love it man. I love it, I agree with everything you said. We stand for the same things guys. So David let's just break it down a little bit.

David Olds: Sure.

David Dodge: So before we jumped on the podcast, we had chatted and I saw you last week-

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: -in Tampa. We didn't really get a whole lot of time to chat then but that's okay, we got some time now, but you had also- you had mentioned to me there and you had told me just a couple minutes ago that you know, that you're doing you know, nationwide essentially wholesaling.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: How many markets are you in?

David Olds: I think there's deals in 18 markets right now.

David Dodge: Oh my goodness he- you're in 18 markets. Okay so can you break that down? Like for somebody that's you know, new. Let's say here it is, look at me, right? I'm in St. Louis MO and I do all my marketing here and I keep the best and wholesale the rest right? And when I say keep the best, like best ones that make rentals, best ones that make fix and flips and if they don't- if they're not in my buy box I wholesale those out but I don't really do a whole lot of marketing outside of let's say a 50 mile radius of where I'm at. You're in 18 different markets-

David Olds: We're actually marketing-

David Dodge: -add on like a second, a third and probably a- you know I probably want to add two or three on at this point versus just doing one.

David Olds: Sure.

David Dodge: If I'm gonna do it, might as well do it. You know like how would you- like what would you say? What would be some advice that you would give for somebody like me you know, to be able to expand into multiple markets? I think it's so cool.

David Olds: Can I tell you how we messed up first? [inaudible].

David Dodge: Please, absolutely. That's the cool part.

David Olds: Nobody tells you how you messed up.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: And we have figured out every way to screw up this business from marketing to business structure to how we pay people like you know, I just tell people the only reason I've survived this long and got successful is I'm just stupid to quit.

David Dodge: Me too, me too.

David Olds: So 2009 I moved from Orlando up to Chattanooga, our goal here when we moved here was to buy small multi families, duplex, triplex, quads, maybe up to 10 units and it's June of 2009 so you know, we came here we're just relentless marketers, right? You know, and back then it's a different deal you remember, you're one of the few people that's been around you know, was driving for dollars, handwritten letters, postcard, bandit signs, that was it, right? That was how we found deals and so my goal was we were doing marketing to find deals for ourselves and you know with the idea of hey if extra stuff comes in, we'll be happy to wholesale it so again you know, our first year, first 6 months, we'd do like 40 deals you know. It was amazing, there was nobody here, really here in Chattanooga doing any business. So over the years we grew that out till we were doing you know, a hundred and something deals here but I had one partner with my wife and then you know, another guy came along, he's like hey I really wanna do this, you know I can- I think I can add some value to the company, to your team, let's all partner up. I'm like that's awesome, next step is Chattanooga and you know there's only 250,000 people here and although like we were rocking it here like I'm not narcissistic enough to think that every deal, wholesale deal, that sells in town is going to be mine, right? Cause you get buyers fatigue when you-

David Dodge: Oh yeah.

David Olds: -flood the market with deals. I said so let's do this and but let's expand out to another market, let's try it. And Dave up until then I'm like the anti virtual wholesaling guy because I feel like-

David Dodge: How long ago was this?

David Olds: This was 2015.

David Dodge: Okay yeah.

David Olds: But late 2015.

David Dodge: like 7 years ago.

David Olds: Yeah, so and mainly because I think it's a very easy sell for the guru crowd to sell virtual wholesaling, right? And it's like cotton candy for people like oh I don't have to leave my house, I never have to go see anybody, I don't have to talk to people, you know, talk in person right? So it's an easy sell virtual and you know I think a lot of people take folks money and they sell them on stuff but a dream that anyways. So we're gonna go to- we're gonna go to Birmingham and it's the first time we've expanded outside of our market and I'm like okay great let's just pull a list just like we pull here, we're gonna send postcards, it's gonna be great. Well we got you know, we got a bunch of responses, we started putting stuff under contract and again I've screwed everything up. Our initial plan was oh we're just gonna work a JV model, it's gonna be fantastic, we bought into some coaching, this guy JV it's great, so we put a bunch of money into this, contracted some properties and what we realized is yeah JV models great but to have a sustained scalable company, scaled up company, it's difficult right? Because nobody cares as much about your deal as you do, right? I mean that's just- that's just a fact.

David Dodge: That's the nature of it sure.

David Olds: So I've got a guy down there you know, let's call him Steve, Steve's- he's got my house and 4 of his. Of course he's pushing his right?

David Dodge: Of course.

David Olds: Cause he gets [inaudible] the profit.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: So we learned some lessons there and Birmingham is a lower end market, right? It's hard to get the $20,000 assignment fees you know, we were averaging like 6 to 8 and then by the time you split it and then now there's 4 partners so 4 thousands coming back we gotta pay you know, all of our expenses, I mean it just- it just didn't work so one of us had the bright idea let's go to Saint Louis, it's gonna be great, not a clue, still not a clue to this day but out of all the places on earth-

David Dodge: I think it's funny when virtual guys come here because this is a challenging market.

David Olds: [inaudible].

David Dodge: Like it's street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood and like the school districts in this town are like really great or really bad, there's like not that many of them that are in the middle there and if you don't know, you don't know.

David Olds: So you know, we figured we crashed and burned in Birmingham, you know we're gonna do it better. It was an even more horrific experience in Saint Louis so same thing right? We're like we're gonna do new postcards, get better message, do the same thing, I do the same thing I'm doing here, I download the list and send off our- send off our marketing and like our acquisitions guys like I got like 8 contracts today, I'm like what are the chan- we're gonna be rich, this is gonna be awesome right? And I can't remember the area of town but you know it's like everything is boarded up, it's these old amazing townhomes that are probably gorgeous the day they were built but the windows are all blown out, you see homeless people walking, it's you know, it's a sketchy area.

David Dodge: Yup yup.

David Olds: So and we are working with a pretty well known investor up there and she was trying to help us out but we just didn't know what we were doing, right? We didn't know how to do market research, we were applying what we do here to other markets and just assuming it was all going to be good and so failure number 2, you know, you're probably $10,000 wasted in marketing and time and all of that and so at this point we figured out okay let's slow down a little bit, I'm not the smartest guy around but let's start with the end in mind right? Who's buying in these areas? Right? Let's download a list of who the cash buyers are within the last year. Let's take that list on excel and let's sort it a couple different ways. What zip codes? What zip codes are people buying in, right? That would seem like a good place to start. You know we were talking earlier about people doing marketing just statewide and the problem is you end up with junk that nobody wants, right? Because start with the end in mind, the end is we're going to cash a check. Who's paying that check essentially is a buyer, what do buyers want? They want a functional property that they can- they can invest in and make money.

David Dodge: Yup.

David Olds: So not every house is gonna fit that criteria, not every investor wants to invest in every area so you know, we kind of slowed down a little bit before we went to our next market. We reevaluated where we were, we looked at what did- I mean we didn't do- we did some deals, not what we thought but anyway so we started looking at the buyers, what zip codes are people buying in? Cool and then we sort it again, what's the average price people pay? Right? Like what are people paying? So we start to build this avatar of what a buyer is looking for, you know, what's kind of like what's the square footage? What's the age? Because every place is different. Macon GA, we do a ton of deals right now in Macon GA. People down there have no problem buying a 1920s house. We go to Phoenix AZ, they do not want a 1920s house, they want something 1980 or newer, right? So I guess to answer your question, market research was really the key for us and once we figured that out, being able to look- pick a market and you can use as a starting point, right? You can go something simple like just Google search like hottest investment markets in the country, right? Just- if you just wanna be basic and fast, you know and it's gonna give you- I saw one the other day I've got it written down but it'll give you like your top 10 markets. Great, go over to ListSource, plug those in and pull the cash buyers list and let's see where people are buying, let's see what price point they're buying, and now you have something to at least give your acquisitions people and your leadgen people something to start with, right? Let's at least try to work smart and so what you can do is now you'll get the top maybe 20 zip codes, well if you're doing SMS marketing, cold calling or direct mail, let's just pull those zip codes, right? Let's pull those and pull our list, at least now we're someplace- we're at least in the ballpark of where buyers want to buy. You know beyond that if you're going to do something like you know pay per click or SEO or any of that stuff, you can kind of do the same thing, it has to be a little bit bigger but let's at least target the right counties, let's target the counties where people are you know, are actually buying. So that was probably one of the biggest things and once we figured that out then it's just tweaking constantly through your model because even if you put- you know there aren't that many but if you put 10 nationwide wholesalers in a room, we all do it just a little bit different, you know, all the processes are different, our goals are a little different.

David Dodge: Yeah. Sure.

David Olds: But yeah you know, find out where buyers are buying. You gotta start with the end in mind, who are you doing this for? We're not doing it to win it for us and just because you got something under contract is not a win, when you assign it and close it, that's your win right? So everybody in your company, for us at least you know, is focused on that end goal and everybody gets paid the same when the property closes so we don't ever wanna lose sight of that for us.

David Dodge: David can you recap real quick? Now here's the thing, I'm taking notes and this is great, you just spit a ton of gold nuggets at us. Guys I'm gonna recap just really quick but I want you to do another thing for me too here.

David Olds: Sure.

David Dodge: But basically market research was the key is what I took away from that, right? The hottest investment markets in the country, just do a quick Google search, find those and then go find the buyers in those and market there. Now you had mentioned types of marketing: SMS, cold calling, direct mail, AdWords. I do all those types of marketing, guys you don't need to necessarily have 47 types of marketing, those are the 4 that most people are using right now, it works. Don't try to rewrite the book, do like David does, do like I do, that's what we're doing. You started with the buyers first, find out what the zip codes that these guys are buying in and then go market in there but I think- and you had mentioned this of course but I'm taking notes I might have skipped over it, so what was the like the main lesson though that you said you know, you wanted to start with how you screwed up. You know, was that just not doing market research?

David Olds: Right.

David Dodge: Is that basically the sum up like just not knowing what market or-?

David Olds: Pretty much yeah.

David Dodge: Okay cool.

David Olds: I mean you know so I knew it so- let me back up. So going virtual is different from being in your home market, right? And again people seem to think going virtual is going to be easier than being in your home market and I disagree. I think when you go virtual it's gonna expose every weakness in your company.

David Dodge: Oh.

David Olds: That you have in your company.

David Dodge: Yup.

David Olds: Because when we're in person Dave, right? I mean first off I go to the- I was explaining this to one of my girls today. You know when I was here in Chattanooga and I was maybe small and you know I was doing-

David Dodge: Now you live there though right?

David Olds: What's that?

David Dodge: You live in Chattanooga?

David Olds: Yeah so what I'm saying is I lived here right? So somebody would call-

David Dodge: When you were marketing there.

David Olds: -hey Mrs. Smith when can I come over? So now I'm standing in the house, so you know I'm also the guy selling the property so you know you're doing those calculations in your head, right? Okay I can sell this for 70, hey Mrs. Smith I'm at 45, whatever right? So we're doing- we're doing those calculations on the fly but when you're- when you go virtual you don't have that luxury right? So we contract without pictures, without anything so when I'm talking to Mrs. Smith, I'm relying on her to give me the condition of the house and a couple things happen there. Sometimes they lie, right? Just does. Sometimes people don't know, right? I mean I bought stuff in Connecticut, the person was in California because they inherited it from their dead uncle, never been to the condo in Connecticut right? No earthly clue, they're like I guess it's good, they have a tenant, tenants are paying, it's good right? So you assume okay good condition. And then sometimes they can you know, they just haven't been to the property. I have a rental that I just turned here in Chattanooga that I had not been to in 8 years so if you'd asked me 4 months ago what condition? Pretty good.

David Dodge: Probably pretty good, they're still living in it.

David Olds: Yeah well I just threw one out. I evicted one last week, 3 years that was a train wreck but so the thing is you got to- when you go virtual, you're acquisitions people have to be really good on the phone, your only tool is your voice right? So you go up, you go down, but you've got to extract that information out of them and understand how to position the call. Hey Dave, here's what we're agreeing to, I think 55 is the right number but I'm basing that on what you're telling me. If when I do my inspections, if anything is not what we talked about or maybe I misunderstood, we might have to come back and look at this- look at this price, does that seem fair? Yeah of course right? Almost everybody says it's fair. So I mean there are just things that you have to do different when you go- when you go virtual that you know, you can slide with when you're you know, when you're in your local market and kind of the example I give people is like if you ever did sports as a kid in high school like if you wrestled, right? You could like muscle people right? You could just physically muscle it and you didn't need to have that technique. When you go virtual, you've gotta have systems processes and techniques because again I'm not standing in the house to say oh my goodness there's a big spot on the roof right? Or on the ceiling so I need to account for that, oh that probably means there's a roof leak, right? You don't- you don't- you're not doing that.

David Dodge: Sure.

David Olds: So anyways yeah it's just a little bit different.

David Dodge: No that makes perfect sense. So not knowing the market and then also you know, if you don't know the market, that's really the first place to- that's like the first bad thing that can happen. If you get into it and you not know it because then you're gonna spend all- a ton of money.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: A ton on of time realizing that that maybe isn't the market that you want to be in or that you should be in so I love it and I respect the hell out of you for starting with the mistakes cause a lot of people they wanna hide their mistakes guys.

David Olds: No, not me.

David Dodge: On the podcast and you know as two guys that have been in the game 15 years, you know like some of the best lessons you can learn from us is what not to do.

David Olds: Sure.

David Dodge: Not necessarily what we're doing that's working right? Don't- don't- don't do this particular thing. So David said don't you know, just start in any random market, find a good one, find one that makes sense. My takeaway or what not to do is don't find deals on the MLS with an agent for 10 years ago and put down 30 grand a deal. Don't do these things guys, don't do these things. I love it. Okay so how we go from one market where I'm in now to let's say 4 or 5, right? I'm gonna probably do at least 2 or 3, you know, whenever I'm going to roll this out which is gonna probably be sometime in the next 60 to 80 hours like it's gonna happen this minute.

David Olds: Yeah let's do it.

David Dodge: Yeah I'm ready baby, I'm ready to roll.

David Olds: [inaudible] shoot, fire, aim.

David Dodge: Shoot, fire, aim, that's right. But I want to- I want to learn a couple things on what you would think but obviously this is huge value for any audience guys. If you are listening or watching this and you're not doing any deals at all, this is going to help you and apply, right? If you're already doing deals in one market and you wanna do it in 2 or 3 or 5, this is going to help you.

David Olds: Yup.

David Dodge: So Dave, what would be your advice to me? And again I'm you know, I'm a little bit ahead of the curve, you know we're already doing tons of deals wholesaling, fix and flip, landlording, but the thing is though I love my own market, I was born and raised here, I didn't choose this market, this market chose me but the problem that I encounter is I'm so used to getting a seller on the phone and saying when can I come walk it? That's gonna be a big paradigm shift for me and all of my you know, partners and employees and everything else because we're not gonna have that luxury anymore, you know? And right now like yeah we may send a contract before we see it, sometimes we'll see it before we send the contract and really seeing it's gonna kinda be not even a possibility unless they send us pictures or we hire somebody else locally third party whatever to go get those for us.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: So I'll quit talking. What would you say though?

David Olds: So here's what I tell people: if it makes you feel more comfortable, start in like an adjacent market that you know, if you're really nervous you can drive to, right? That was one of the reasons we picked Birmingham which for some reason we drove by Huntsville which is an amazing market to Birmingham which I'm not- I love everybody in Birmingham but it was a little bit of a challenge. So if you're nervous, start someplace that's relatively close, right? So if you're in Louisville, maybe go to Lexington, you know, something like that if you wanna branch out just a little bit. No matter where you're at, almost everybody has Propstream, right? Propstream is for $99 my God.

David Dodge: Oh it's the best value out there.

David Olds: Best tool out there.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: It always befuddles me when people are like you know, oh I'm gonna get a realtor to give me comps, I'm like are you insane?

David Dodge: Yeah that's gonna take all- that's gonna take a month.

David Olds: [inaudible] the whole business. Yeah you're gonna bet your livelihood on a realtor getting back to you and giving you good information? Listen I got a realtor in my office, I am friends with a lot of realtors but just like investors most of them are dopey, right?

David Dodge: Yeah right.

David Olds: They don't know what to do. Spend the 99 bucks, get Propstream but learn how to comp, right? I'll tell you-

David Dodge: That's a great- that's a great piece of advice.

David Olds: Here's what I do right? I'm gonna tell you straight right now I'm not on the 70% minus ARV and repairs and all that stuff 'cause who knows, right? What does it cost to put in a countertop in Montana? I don't know, no idea. I guarantee it's different than Atlanta, different in Charlotte, different in Chattanooga. Here's what I do that's worked for us and I discovered this really early on: I pull the comps, I pull them within a half mile within the last year, sort them low to high, right? Cause what's the odds David that the property I'm buying is similar condition to those properties that sold on the low end?

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: Cause here's the thing and I've tested this and it's just- I've never found anybody that can dispute it. When you comp properties low to high or high to low, whichever way you want to go, alright? And there's generally 3 levels: your top properties, that's you're ARV right? Somebody's gone in, remodeled it, it's awesome, right? So you have your top level is kind of your ARV. That middle level is gonna be bank owned properties, grandmas house that lived in and maybe it's not really updated or you know, some people lived in it and they you know, they got transferred and it's kind of it is what it is but it's you know, it's FHA-able.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: You know? It's that area where we might wholetail a property. But genuinely that third level, that third level's the cash deals, right?

David Dodge: Yeah, the low end but if you sort low to high, that's gonna be at the top.

David Olds: Right. Either way, sort it though but-

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: But look at those low numbers because that's gonna tell you something. I know we're in a weird upside down market right now where I just got offered $400,000 cash the other day on one of my rehabs but for the most part that lower level, that lower range, that's where cash buyers are buying. So when I look up this 1950s house in Saint Louis, Birmingham, Austin, Texas, whatever it is, whatever that low level is, it tells me where cash buyers are buying.

David Dodge: Yup.

David Olds: That tells me the range, like I don't need to do all those other calculations, right? So depending upon condition, right? If it's average, we're going to be in the middle there. In the middle is what your cash buyer will pay you, that's not what you put on a contract, right?

David Dodge: Good point.

David Olds: Crucial to understand that. So and again these are like quick rule of thumb fast assumptions right? That you can teach your acquisitions people. So you know, let's say that range is kind of between like 65 and 73, right? Now if your house is in real- they tell you it's in really fantastic shape, maybe you can go a little bit, you know you can imagine selling it a little above that but also if it's had a fire and has no floors right? I mean you need to- you gotta have some common sense and adjust there.

David Dodge: You got it.

David Olds: But that's what we use as a range as like a target range for contracting properties 'cause that's what properties- David this is what properties like yours in your neighborhood have sold for, right?

David Dodge: You're basically-

David Olds: That's the phrase that we use all the time 'cause oftentimes a seller will wanna go well Dave that property down the road just sold for 400,000.

David Dodge: Yeah but that one also has 180 grans worth of rehab, yours has zero.

David Olds: Yeah that's what my acquisitions people say, oh that's amazing maybe I- maybe I didn't look at that one, what's the address?

David Dodge: Right. What's the address? Let me pull it up, okay.

David Olds: Oh Mrs. Smith, your 1950s house-

David Dodge: Mr. and Mrs. Seller, this house has granite countertops, yours doesn't have countertops at all, there's no countertops in there hahaha.

David Olds: Yeah good thing. That one's also 1200 square foot bigger than your 1950s house and it was built in '98.

David Dodge: Yes, the age, all of these things right right. Okay.

David Olds: That's why that key phrase and I don't know if you picked up on it when we're talking to sellers is hey Mrs. Smith let me see what houses like yours in your neighborhood have sold for.

David Dodge: Love that.

David Olds: That's the $1,000,000 phrase right there I'm telling you because that eliminates all that extra stuff, right? Hey let me look at what 1950s 3 bedroom 1 bath 1150 square foot houses are selling for. Oh Mr. Smith here's how we do it, it's very simple. You know I'm gonna look at what houses like yours in your neighborhood have sold for, I'm gonna estimate repairs, if they're selling for 80, you're gonna have 20 repairs, that's 50. You know I don't need to make a lot of money Mrs. Smith, I need to make about 5 grand so my offers gonna be 42, 45, maybe 46.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: And you see what we've done there, we've done a little- that's how we- that's it.

David Dodge: Yup, I like to spread offers too, kind of gave them a feel for it you know, I love that. So you had mentioned that you're not using the MAO formula, you're not using the you know, MAO equals ARV times .7 or whatever that discount rate may be minus repairs minus a wholesale fee instead you're just going straight to the low end comps and saying listen this is what they're selling for already, let me take a small wholesale fee off of that and that's my offer. I love that approach because it eliminates you from having to go figure all this other due diligence out which I'm sure you do once you have a contract on it.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: But prior to that it's a lot of time wasted. I love it.

David Olds: Cause we want to talk to as many people as we can, right?

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: So within that that's how we're bringing them in on a range. For us, in our company we've got somebody who underwrites all of our deals before we contract it so that person you know, my acquisition people they're on the speed plan. You know, once we get something that's narrowed down then it goes to my underwriter, she'll actually look at it go okay is this on a main road? Is this next to a factory? Is just you know, is a nuclear power plant over there? You know what I mean, what is the area? I'll be like okay you know we need to talk a little bit for this or we can go a little bit higher here you know and she'll do some very simple math like ARV you know we take off 10% for  that's what it will cost the seller to sell when they remodel it you know, how much does a seller wanna make? $200,000 house, great they probably wanna make 30 so we subtract that, what's the repairs? You know, so we can figure out manually what roughly what they're- the end buyer because always start with the end in mind, what their maximum allowable offer is and then we just wanna make sure we're 20 to 25 below that. That's all.

David Dodge: Nice.

David Olds: It's not complicated, I promise you. I'm not that smart so I can teach a 3rd grader.

David Dodge: Hey me and you both buddy, I get it. Okay let me recrap, let me recap not crap hahaha. Alright to recap, your advice for somebody like me or anybody listening that wants to expand into new markets, that's how I titled this right?

David Olds: Right.

David Dodge: Start someplace relatively close, I think that's great advice, you know me in Saint Louis trying to go do deals in Washington state you know maybe a little crazy but like you know, there's a ton of great markets right down the road, and when I say down the road like 100 to 200 miles away like that's still a good distance but like why go 1800 miles if I can go 100? I think that's a great piece of advice.

David Olds: Get your feet wet, right?

David Dodge: Get your feet wet, right. Use Propstream to pull nationwide comps and learn how to comp. Great advice, love it. Don't worry about the MAO formula, instead pull the actual comps, sort them low to high, find the low, find the medium, find the high. Focus on the low ones guys, that is really the range where you're gonna want to be buying because your cash buyers are gonna be buying there, right? So don't try to- don't try to you know, come in higher than the buyers, that doesn't- that doesn't work. Wholesaling is nothing more than buying great and selling good. Simple simple simple simple, right? The middle is where the cash buyers you know are going to pay you on that low end side, right? So be below the low end, right? And I'm taking notes here right? And one of the things I really liked is you said let me see what houses like yours in your neighborhood have sold for. Guys that is the- that's the pitch right there, right? Because then you can help them compare and here's the thing and I know Dave's gonna know this, I'm positive, but here's the thing guys: it's never me or David versus the seller, that's a terrible attitude. Instead it's me and you Mrs. Robinson, the seller versus the market, right? So you don't ever want to position this to where it's like me and you negotiating, no no no it's me and you on a team and we're going to figure out what the market is going to bear and pay and we're going to both agree on those numbers and if they don't agree then we're going to do everything in our power to get them to see the light that they may be a little crazy or you know maybe a little you know, higher than they should be.

David Olds: [inaudible] that's right, right.

David Dodge: Right but that's the goal is you don't want them to ever think it's you versus them, it's you and them together on a team versus the market and if the market's only gonna bear 60 grand and they're asking 140, get off the phone, get off the phone, it's a waste of time, right? Be polite of course but stop trying to work a lead that's not going to be a deal. I love it. Alright so behind that, where do we go next?

David Olds: I mean I would just want to jump in on that 'cause what you said was really great. So we get a lot of leads in pay per click, SMS and all that stuff and people will sometimes tell you 400,000, right? I may go- we get on the phone with everybody 'cause people say dumb stuff right? So we just wanna- we wanna make sure you know there's nothing we can do here 'cause I can't tell you how many times someone said 400 with contract in 70 right? So that was a mistake I made in my early days, I had a full time job, my marketing came to a call center, right? So I would get these emails and I would sit there and look at it and I would talk myself out of calling people so don't be afraid to talk to people but the other thing that was really great is you know it's me and the seller, the image that I give to my employees, my team members, get on the same side of the table like hey Mr. Seller-

David Dodge: Love that.

David Olds: -put your arms around him, let's see if we can figure this out. I wanna pay you or you know, our company wants to pay you full value for your property. I wanna pay you what houses like yours in your neighborhood are selling for minus repairs, does that make sense? Yes. Right? Cause you wanna get a bunch of small yes-es along the way. Does that make sense? Awesome, okay and by this time I've long pulled up comps and I'm talking to him like okay so here's one that sold for you know, do you know where 123 Main Street is? It looks like it's about a quarter mile away. Yeah yeah yeah. Cool okay well one the same size as yours just sold last month at 60,000 and here's on Elm Street, looks like you know, slow down right? Like this is the point in the conversation you're trying to slow down 'cause you want them to be able to follow you, right? So here's one over on Elm Street it looks like it sold for a couple 1000 bucks more. Here's this other one on Penelope Lane, it was a little bit lower, you know. So this is how you're getting them to understand what their property's worth right? Cause everybody, you know, we're in a hot market right? So now you've got to combat that a little bit so we're just trying to bring expectations down into reality. Now like you said they're out of whack, they're out of whack, hey if anything changes you know I'd love to follow up with you in 30, 60 days you know, save my number I'd love to help you but yeah. They're not- if it's not a deal move on, [inaudible] so I'm sorry I didn't mean to interrupt you.

David Dodge: No no no, I love whenever we reiterate things because it shows the audience, the listeners, the viewers, how valuable these things really are guys so if you didn't take away a golden nugget from that, back up the- back this up and go listen to the last 3 or 4 or 5 minutes because that is so incredibly important. That's what separates the guys that are doing you know 1 or 2 deals a month from the guys that are doing 15 or 20. We have a different mindset on this, this is not me versus the seller, I can't- here's the thing: we can't force somebody to be motivated, we can't do that but what we can do is we can help them see that the offer we're making yeah it's going to be low, come on let's be honest it's going to be low that's how we make money but it's also equally valuable, right? It's a fair offer, right? Yeah it's low but it's fair, here's why, the other houses that are similar to yours in the area or in your neighborhood have sold for this because they're equally bad, that's the fair market value of it. So Dave I love it, very cool very cool. Alright so now that we are- let's see here, we're not using the MAO formula, we're basically sorting, we're finding out those, we're getting the seller on our side, what's next from there?

David Olds: So then we're contracting it, right? And so Mrs. Smith fantastic again yeah so we're agreeing to 60,000, I think that sounds right, you know of course that 60,000 is just based on what you're telling me for condition 'cause I'm way over here in Tennessee and you're in South Dakota so here's the next step, and this is really crucial. No matter what side of your business you're on whether it's your acquisitions, dispositions, transactions, you gotta tell people what's happening next right? Cause what we do is weird, right? It is, it's not a realtor, it's not the traditional method of people buying and selling houses, right? So hey Mr. Smith let me just- let me explain to you what's next? First off my transaction coordinator is going to call you within the next 24 hours and we're gonna need to get some information. Here's our process, right? First thing we're gonna do is I'm going to pay somebody that works for us over there and wherever it is, North Dakota, South Dakota, whatever the town is and they're gonna come by and they need to take some pictures and a quick video for me, right? And that's just for me to confirm what the condition is and usually when I get that, I can start to get an idea of what kind of repairs we're gonna need to do once we close on the property and we're going to try to get this thing closed as quick as we can, right? Cause the sellers end in mind is getting that check, right? So we're always moving them towards that and keeping that goal in front of mind. [inaudible] I call that information, I'll send it out to our partners, our contractors. They'll probably need to come through once maybe twice like I try really hard to get them all there at once. If you've ever dealt with a contractor, getting them to show up on time is like pulling teeth. So is that okay? Does that work for you? Great perfect. So here's what we're gonna do, I'm gonna have my transaction coordinator call you and she will start to schedule- she'll be your point of contact and she'll schedule these things going forward but if you ever have a question, you call me right back, this is my number, it goes to my cell and you know, I'll answer whatever questions you've got. So the next step is telling the person what the next step is. Same thing on dispo right? You gotta- once you're under contract, you have to tell the buyer what's next 'cause if you don't, uncertainty and fear sets in and then they start wondering what's going on? Are they really buying my house or- you know, is this title company- is this real? Is it a scam? Like stuff gets in people's head and now you're gonna chase that buyer till-

David Dodge: I love that. I gotta stop and reiterate, guys tell them what's next.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: This is so valuable because if you just send the contract and then you go MIA, they're going to start looking for somebody else to buy that house from them, right? So tell them your closing coordinator or transaction coordinator is gonna be in touch, let them know that you know, you need to get somebody out there to take some pics or videos, I would imagine in some cases they say well I can take pics and videos, even better.

David Olds: They can, sure.

David Dodge: But if you don't want to rely on them and/or you just want to make sure that they're not sending you the best of the best photos and angles, get your own guy out there. So on that topic though so like you know let's say you pick a new market, this is your 19th now right? Who- you don't know anybody in you know Springfield IL, so who do you call to get to do that?

David Olds: So again in catastrophic things that I've done in my past, this was for me the single biggest mental hurdle when I first started with virtual.

David Dodge: Mindset, that's what I said.

David Olds: I mean my God I could not wrap my head around this. Again I feel like I'm pretty smart, right? Graduated from college, I've done a lot of deals in town but going virtual I could not and it's the dumbest easiest thing but I couldn't get there. So here's what we do and here's what I'll do David: if anybody that's listening to this, you sent me a message on Instagram and my Instagram is davidoldsrei and you say that you were listening to this podcast, send me a- I want you to follow me 'cause I'm trying to you know.

David Dodge: Of course, go follow David guys, davidoldsrei.

David Olds: I'm trying to be as popular as the 19 year old girls that work for me.

David Dodge: Oh absolutely, guys Instagram David Olds, D-A-V-I-D O-L-D-S R-E-I. You're a fool if you don't go follow him, this guy is the real deal.

David Olds: What I will do is I will send you a document explaining exactly how we do this, how we post for this, we post on Craigslist, same thing on Facebook, and I'll give you a little rundown. So we post something very generic, Craigslist, Facebook ads, whatever. Hey our company is buying real estate in your area and I need to hire somebody that can go take 50 to 75 photos and about a 5 minute video, this job pays $75, message me if you're interested. Boom that's it, right? So now what's gonna happen? You're gonna get a million emails, right? And the next thing very simply I have a document all set up, I send it to them and I said hey here's what you're going to do when you get there, right? And I've actually created a video and there's a video link how to take pictures of a property, right? I took one of my girls that worked for me, we went out to one of my properties and I filmed her taking pictures explaining what she's doing, right? Because if I'm going to pay this amount of money to send somebody over there, I wanna make sure they're doing the right thing, right? That we're not holding our phone like this right? Cause that drives me crazy.

David Dodge: Those who can't see and are listening, he's holding his phone like you normally would hold your phone but that's what we like to call portrait and you wanna turn your phone sideways and we want to get a landscape type video because when we're walking into houses, you wanna try to get as much in the picture as you can and also you can't share those videos easily to YouTube or whatever, they just don't work as well. Turn the phone sideways, pro tip, love it.

David Olds: Yeah so you know, we have a video like hey stand in the corners you know, take a picture. If you've got the .5 thing on your iPhone like that'll give you the widest view, that's what I want. I'm not interested in the picture of the chip on the countertop, right?

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: It's not the most important picture to me. I need big picture stuff, right? Because again, the end in mind and I beat this like a horse all the time, who is going to be looking at these properties? Your end buyer. I want that guy to make a decision from sitting on his couch, right? Our job as a wholesaler is to provide value to these people, right? Be easy to work with, do not be a pain in the ass, be simple, right? Provide you know, good photos. So again, our little document, hey I want a minimum two pictures in every room from the corners as far back in the corners as you can get. I want pictures of every side of the house, I want pictures shooting down each side of the street and then I want a video starting at the front door, your phone horizontal slowly walking through and we explain all of this in the video that's in the document. If anybody wants it, message me and say you listened to a podcast with David. You know, kind of shoot the floor, shoot the walls, you know, you can't really see it but I'm kind of going in a circle here. I wanna see the whole room, it's not a race to get through there, move slow, I need- and we explain to the person taking pictures, I need to be able to see the true condition of this house. That's it, right? So we take all that stuff up and then we do our marketing on the dispo side, we package it up and we'll get it out to buyers.

David Dodge: Woah woah woah woah! You just did like 80% and then you just said then we just package it up on dispo. Woah woah Dave we got to slow down a little brother. Okay so here, let me recap though guys. So we are going to make a friend with the seller, that's really what it comes down to. We're going to make a friend, we're going to build trust, right? And we are going to get them on our team. It's not me versus you, it's me and you versus the seller and we're going to show them the comps, right? Love it. Get them to agree. If they- if they are motivated which that's the goal, they're gonna agree and they're gonna say cool what's your offer at? It's not my favorite number but let's do the deal, great. Win-win everybody is winning. So then what we're going to do is we're going to tell them what happens next, I love this step. Be transparent with them in a sense of saying here's what you can expect to happen, right? Closing coordinator, transaction coordinator, whatever you wanna call them, they're gonna contact you and we're going to get somebody to come out in the next couple days ideally, maybe a couple more whatever, and take these pictures and these videos. How do we do that? That was my question and David is simple, I love how simple the answer was, right? Go on Craigslist, go on Facebook and make a post and he's even gonna help you guys with the post and what to do and the directions, I love it. Go check out his Instagram davidoldsrei again and you're gonna essentially pay somebody 75 bucks, right? And do you Venmo or PayPal them or how do you pay them typically?

David Olds: And again if you can get it for 50, great, sometimes you know we're in a market and somebody's gotta travel a little further, they might-

David Dodge: 50 to 100, whatever, maybe even little more, whatever right.

David Olds: So we tell them in our document, I want this you know, upload it to a Google Drive, send it to me. Like the girl in the office will sit here, flip through, flip through, hey it's good and I always tell them like hey do it while you're there in case I need something else. Pictures look good, bam Venmo.

David Dodge: Bam, got it.

David Olds: Like we're done. Like we're paying people, nobody's ever gonna have to chase us for money.

David Dodge: And you pay them with like PayPal or Venmo or what?

David Olds: Whatever you wanna use.

David Dodge: Whatever they wanna use, even better, make it easy for them.

David Olds: Yeah my girls have my Venmo and they've got my Amex locked up to it, I don't even know what they're buying half the time.

David Dodge: Got it, no it makes perfect sense.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: So send someone out there to get those pics, right? That's how you find them then once you find them and they seem like a good fit, hire them. Get them out there to get those pics and those videos. One thing I want to highlight is you said I wanna see two pictures in every room and I want you to get in the corner, stand back as far as you can, get as much in the picture as you can and then you also mentioned start- and then do a video too, I want both, I want pictures and I want videos. And I tell my people hey if you take 200 pictures, I'm good with it, just don't come back with 4.

David Olds: Well yeah.

David Dodge: Like 4, 4, not 400, 4. That's not enough right? You could delete pictures but the one thing you can't do is add them without being there so the more the better right? And then additionally a video.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: And a video is really helpful because it gets you an understanding of the layout. When you're looking at pictures, it may be a little difficult to say okay well this room looks like it connects to that one. Well in the video you're walking through the house, right? Love it right? So they then get this, they send it back to you and your team or me and my team, we review, we pay them, they're happy. Love it alright. And then what? So now we have this video and these pictures, next we're gonna do like you would do in your own market, you're gonna market, you're gonna find these buyers and the very first thing that David and I started talking about was when we go look for markets, don't just find you know, any market, find markets where there's a lot of transactions, find markets where there's a lot of people buying and rehabbing and renting, right? And you're going to find those buyers and essentially it's kind of a buyer first stance on what market. So we've already done all that but we now know that we have a deal and we have these buyers so next would just be marketing, right? And it's funny because marketing is how we start this business, wholesaling specifically, it's also how we end this transaction. We market to find a deal, we market to find somebody to buy that deal from us. If you don't- if you haven't understood or seen this yet guys, this is the marketing business that we're in, real estate is the product or the service or whatever you wanna call it. We're not really in the real estate business-

David Olds: Not as a wholesaler.

David Dodge: -as a wholesaler, no we're in the marketing business. So David I'm just really passionate about this man, I just want everybody to know if you wanna be in the wholesaling business, you are in the marketing business guys, that's really where it comes down. So next we're going to prepare the deal.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: We're either gonna get that Google Drive or that Google photo or our website, I mean it could easily- it could be something simple as creating a Facebook post that's shareable or a Craigslist post and sharing that URL with people. Don't overthink the marketing you know, you just gotta do it though but you need to basically make the deal presentable, right? So we do that and then next we're gonna start contacting buyers and that could be in a form of a blast, SMS, email, it could be posting online, it's just any activity that is going to get eyeballs on your deal. Would you- is there anything you want to add to that Dave? I mean it's pretty simple.

David Olds: So one small speed bump, as soon as the pictures come back, we reevaluate the property, right? So oftentimes I'll-

David Dodge: Love it, see that's a great tip.

David Olds: -one of my girls will bring it in and go hey.

David Dodge: Hey somethings not right here.

David Olds: Have you seen these?

David Dodge: Okay that was one that we skipped over so really it's reevaluate-

David Olds: Right.

David Dodge: -then the market. I love that, okay.

David Olds: Right. So have you seen these pictures? And oftentimes I'll pull up like the call and listen to the call or I'll watch the notes, I'll be like. I look from one screen to the other and I'm like it's not really what we're buying.

David Dodge: Yeah ooh we might need to call the seller and tell him that you know, we're not going away but at this price it's gonna be really challenging for this to actually work. Got it, makes sense.

David Dodge: Yeah so we'll set that stage for like hey there's a couple things here that we didn't really talk about, I'm going to get my guys in there, we're gonna look at it but like I'm pretty sure we're gonna have to look at this price or hey everything is great. So what you're doing, what I'm doing with those pictures once they come back right? Is now again two screens on my monitor, I'm pulling up- now I'm taking those comps and I'm flipping them around and I wanna see what the high comp is. Now I'm looking at my property pictures, I'm like okay light rehab, moderate rehab, full rehab, like where are we at right? So how do I- how do I price this property so that an end buyer can buy it and make money, right? Again start with the end in mind, you have to know what does a buyer wanna make? I'll tell you for here in most places on a 100,000 a buyer wants to make 20,000, that's it. Every hundred after that, add 10. 200,000 they probably wanna make 30, some are gonna look 40, some will take 15, just use that as a rule of thumb, 20 + 10 every time you go up. So you know we're looking at that.

David Dodge: That's a great tip by the way.

David Olds: Yeah so we're looking at that, we're looking at the pictures, we're looking at the comps and now and you know, go to Zillow right? Go into Zillow, put the address in, you know, kind of do a little radius search and look at other properties that have sold even though they're MLS probably, you can start to get a feel for is this average condition? Is it better? Is it worse? Right? So we target everything for $20,000 assignment fee on our acquisition side but sometimes it comes over and I'm like motherload, I'm putting 60 on this one but other times I'm like well 10 on this one and we'll see, we might have to renegotiate, right?

David Dodge: Sure sure.

David Olds: So at this point now you're establishing your buying price to your end buyer and then we're going out and doing the marketing. So at the very beginning one thing we talked about you went to that new market, you did some research, you downloaded some cash buyers, okay now those are your cash buyers.

David Dodge: Now those- okay so guys boom. So you're like okay well Dave, Dave and Dave, this is great Dave and Dave, where do we going to market these deals? Well the first thing you did was find a market that had buyers, those are the same people that you are going to start contacting, calling, texting, emailing, and do not discount calling, right? I mean here's the thing guys.

David Olds: 80% of my deal's over the phone.

David Dodge: Here's the thing: Brent Daniels has a program called 'Talk to People', it's a cold calling specific program but I love the name of it so much because that's really what this business is about, it's just talking to people, right? So no matter if you're doing bandit signs or direct mail or AdWords or SMS or cold calling or radio advertisements or billboard advertisements, I can think of 100 other things too right? There's 100 things to do. At the end of the day, all those marketing channels lead to one thing: a phone call, either they're calling you or your people or you are calling them period.

David Olds: Right.

David Dodge: Now, I have done a couple deals where I've never talked to the seller via phone, it's via text only and it's really really kind of weird and it's random.

David Olds: you never know if [inaudible].

David Dodge: So there's always gonna be- here's what I'm trying to get at: there's always gonna be the exception to the rule but 99.9% of the time you're gonna have to get on the phone with them so the sooner you do that, the better and I'm talking more about acquisitions on the motivated seller but I'm also talking about the dispositions with the motivated hopefully cash buyer, right? You have to talk to them on the phone, I love it.

David Olds: And that happens with our new dispo people, they wanna try it, they get like oh somebody texted me on Facebook, text, whatever you-

David Dodge: Like cool call them. Yeah get the number.

David Olds: You gotta jump them from text to the phone.

David Dodge: Immediately.

David Olds: So I've sold deals over the text but it's a guy [inaudible].

David Dodge: Yeah we have too but it's not the norm by any means.

David Olds: It is not the norm.

David Dodge: I mean it's a very small slice.

David Olds: 100%. You know it's funny I digress, I know we're probably going long but so last night I was in one of the groups.

David Dodge: No we're good, I'm having fun David we can go all day.

David Olds: Cool man. So I was in one of the groups and somebody was asking a question about- it started out he said I gotta 100 numbers to text, which service should I use? And someone's like oh you should use Batch, I'm like dude.

David Dodge: If you only have 100 just use your cell phone come on.

David Olds: Dude that's what I said, I'm like-

David Dodge: You sitting here trying to think about what? Like dude you could have done 5 texts in that time, maybe 10, come on let's go.

David Olds: There's some mindset issues here as I- you know it's like 11 o'clock, 10 o'clock, whatever it is. I'm like the approachable guy on Facebook and social media, it's me, it's not my assistant, it's me so you know it's 9:30, 10 o'clock at night and I'm texting this guy back and I'm like dude it's 100 numbers just text, you could've been done by now.

David Dodge: You could be done by no, right.

David Olds: Take action like let's do this. He's like but it'll take me all day. I'm like I promise you it'll take you 30 minutes. Get Google Voice and do it off your laptop, it's [inaudible].

David Dodge: Yeah you can use Google Voice for free.

David Olds: Yeah yeah. So the-

David Dodge: Copy and paste, like your phone might be kind of hard 'cause it's like fingers, right? Well you got a whole keyboard and a mouse here, let's go. Yeah.

David Olds: So the next thing, it kind of- we worked our way all the way down and it's like 9 responses on this Facebook page and he's like well I really don't like to talk to people.

David Dodge: Oh my goodness.

David Olds: I swear, I swear. Well first off I-

David Dodge: You better hire somebody who does cause that's the business my friend.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: So you know the great thing about Facebook is there's a lot of information out there, the bad thing is some people take one little sliver of information and try to go out there and do it and you just need a little bit more than that. Anyways I told him like well dude you're gonna have to hire somebody to do acquisitions and dispo and I said it's gonna eat up a lot of your profit by doing it this way and he's like well what is dispo? I'm like ooh okay. I'm like God bless you for getting this far, right?

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: You found the group, you asked a question, you're trying to take action, but I said listen you might just have to power through. Like you wouldn't believe it I'm incredibly introverted, I'm exerting every bit of energy I've got in my body to do this right now. I just you know, I just want to sit in the office and do some work but you gotta get out of your shell, you gotta go out there and be able to talk to people like you said and we were in Brent's program, we were one of the first people in that like first year.

David Dodge: Oh man Brent's one of my good buddies. I love that guy, he's such a caring- he just- he cares you know and a lot of the guys out there that are you know, in that type of space like you know, they're just like oh yeah here's the product, get to work and it's like no this- he gives his cell phone number to his students and like he's just an amazing human. I love that guy.

David Olds: I just love that energy, I wish I could borrow it a little bit.

David Dodge: Oh he's just got such great energy. I love it.

David Olds: It's bananas.

David Dodge: Bananas hahaha.

David Olds: But anyways so yeah you gotta get on the phone with people, you gotta jump them out of text and onto the phone call as quick as you can because again this is a weird thing that we do, right? When I used to put out bandit signs, I would you know, I would just- again I'm always putting myself and maybe that's my superpower, I put myself in the position of the person that I'm dealing with. I'm like okay.

David Dodge: No better way to learn it.

David Olds: So I'm gonna put out this sign, somebody's gonna drive up to this intersection, stop, look to the left and go huh we buy houses, well that sounds fun, let me call this person.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: They call me and we have a 10 minute conversation I'm like I would love to come over and look at it and you invite the stranger to your house. I walkthrough for 10 minutes, I give you a contract and you sign a contract to deeply discount your property like all of that's weird, right?

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: None of it is normal.

David Dodge: No.

David Olds: It's good to us but go to Walmart and run that by somebody that you pass in the pantyhose aisle, right?

David Dodge: Yeah, you want to sell your car to me real quick for-

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: Let's go out there and let's jump in the backseat of the car and let's look around.

David Dodge: Yeah let's run some numbers here buddy like what?

David Olds: Yeah it's weird. So people do business with people they know, like and trust.

David Dodge: Love it.

David Olds: You have to understand building rapport with people quickly.

David Dodge: Oh that's so important.

David Olds: And I tell people if you can get somebody to laugh that's like instant you know, rapport.

David Dodge: Yes.

David Olds: Study some John Martinez, study Tony Robbins, you know, all these guys, Chris Voss. You gotta be able to build rapport so yeah I don't even know where we're at but I need to stop and throw that in.

David Dodge: Okay so here we- no no this is great so we're almost through the whole process though which is great. So basically you know, we're gonna reevaluate guys, that was a big thing that like I was missing here. Get the pictures, get the videos, reevaluate, is it still a deal? Did what they tell you, does it line up or are they way off? And if they're way off, hey guys it's okay just get them on the phone before you start marketing and wasting a bunch of time and see if you're able to get you know, a better price or you know maybe there's information that you didn't have before now you do. Regardless reevaluate, if everything is go then go and if not circle back to the seller.

David Olds: Right.

David Dodge: Next was we are going to start marketing and that can happen in a number of ways but you now have a contract guys, you have equitable interest in the property, start marketing that equitable interest in that property, find a buyer. And then once we're marketing, buyers are going to call and they're going to text and they're gonna email but the goal is to get them in the property, is it not?

David Olds: Yeah 100%. So we do a lot of training for our dispo people and so we've got a little like you know, kind of a call flow, it's not really a script it's a hey Dave thanks for calling me you know, how'd you find the property? Like that- we wanna know that 'cause we wanna know what marketing channels are working. Awesome so good, hey let me tell you a little bit about us. So Dave we're a property liquidation company so what we do is we sell discounted properties all across the country to very serious landlords, contractors, and investors, people like you. Cause everybody wants- no matter where you're at in the real estate food chain, you always wanna be like the guy above you, right? So you know small words, hey we sell them to guys like you, let me explain our process. Our process is super simple, we guarantee clear titles with all of our properties, we prorate the taxes so you're not you know, buying anything with any back taxes, I know some people do that, we don't. You know and we have a one page contract, it's so simple a third grader can understand it, I'm selling, your buying. We have some EMD that goes to the title company, you know, once we agree on a price and a closing date, bam we're done, we're sending this over to the title company, we're getting this finished, usually we can wrap it up in 5 to 10 days so tell me what kind of properties you're looking for, right? Does that sound like what you're looking for? Cause I want to establish at the beginning right is this somebody who's looking for their personal house that's gonna get a loan, we know that's not gonna work with wholesaling.

David Dodge: Yeah it's not gonna work typically, right.

David Olds: You know everything is you know, it's like a tale of two streets right? Everything is like Y in the road. I want to disqualify people as quick as I can because the worst thing that can happen is you spend two hours on the phone with somebody and you think I'm selling this deal, again by the jet we're making 50 grand and oh yeah let me get with my loan officer and see if we can do this. You're like wah wah wah.

David Dodge: Wah wah wah.

David Olds: So we're you know, we're trying to disqualify the people that are out and then the people who call in, you know, we want to move them forward in the process so again here's how our process works, right? Cause if you don't do that at the beginning, at the end after you contract oh wait I gotta pay my realtor and it's gotta be at my title company and it's gonna be I only put down $10.

David Dodge: That's a great nugget.

David Olds: So if you don't do that at the front, I promise- I had this conversation one of my girls yesterday, you will chase this buyer all the way to closing, it's gonna be- it's gonna be some issue all the way along so yeah hey here's what the next step is, here's how we work, does that sound like something you're interested in? Yeah great. You know, tell me what kinds of properties you're buying. So here I'm trying to slow down the conversation a little bit if I can, right? Not everybody will do it with you but tell me what kind of properties you're buying Dave 'cause here's what we're doing, we're building our database 'cause I don't know if you're going to buy this property or not but I'm gonna get your information and you're going in my database and if you tell me you want blue duplexes on the top of the hill in Chattanooga, that's going in my in my database 'cause next time I have a blue duplex I'm calling you first right? So even- you know every call is valuable, right? Every single call, building that buyers list ,hey what's your email? What's your phone number? Tell me what's your ideal criteria. How many deals did you buy this year? Now we're getting into- we're in October now. So hey man what's your goal for the rest of the year? Did you meet your goals? How many were you supposed to buy this year? Oh you need three more? Cool I think this one fits your criteria, let's lock this one up and let me see what else I can find for you, right? Again we're here to provide value and service to people.

David Dodge: I love it. No that's perfect, you nailed it. But guys the takeaway from there is you know, be transparent with people, right? Tell them what they can expect, right? What's the next step, right? That has never turned around and bit me, let's put it that way but what has bit me when I'm not- when I don't tell people the next step and they're sitting around wondering you know, it goes on both the front side of these transactions as well as the backside. So speaking of transactions though.

David Olds: Yes.

David Dodge: We get through this whole process and we find a buyer, we make a friend with that buyer or I'm sorry with the seller. We find a seller, we make a frame with that seller, we contract, we get a guy out or a girl out, take some pictures, take some videos, we reevaluate, boom it works, we start marketing, we find a buyer, we send the buyer out, the buyer walks the property, calls us back and says David which could be either one of us I love it. So he says David I like the deal, let's do the deal and let's say we have a $15,000 spread, he's like I'll pay you a full asking this is great, you left money on the bone for me because you're a good wholesaler.

David Olds: That's right.

David Dodge: I'll repeat that: you left money on the- meat on the bone for me because you're a good wholesaler, right? You gotta buy great and sell good, you can't- you can't buy great and sell bad.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: People aren't going to buy those deals, you gotta sell them good right? But then we get- we now have two contracts basically.

David Olds: Yeah.

David Dodge: What do we do from here? How do we get paid?

David Olds: Yeah so when we enter a market and we do it a little bit differently now 'cause we're nationwide but when we would enter an individual market, I would go on the Facebook group and say hey who is [inaudible].

David Dodge: I love it. Such easy simple advice guys, love it.

David Olds: And you're gonna get 40 responses and if you're in Charlotte, 38 of them are gonna say [inaudible].

David Dodge: Boom there you go, you're like that's the guy, right.

David Olds: Yeah so you're gonna get a bunch of responses, you're gonna call one or two of them, say hey I got a deal I'd like to do here, would you like to review my contracts first off, right? Cause let's make sure we're not gonna have any issues, some markets are a little bit different, ours we've been doing this 12 years so I've never had a problem you know, in any state with ours but whatever contract you're using like have somebody look at it, it's not gonna cost you anything.

David Dodge: I live it.

David Olds: Say hey I'm gonna send this over, can you just take a quick look at it? Tell me if you have any issues. Here's what I'm doing, it's an assignment of contract, that's what I'm- do you do those? Because again not every title company is the same, right? Like just like [inaudible].

David Dodge: Some will let you do a dry double, some will want it to be wet which means you have to refund it, some states require attorneys, but here's the thing guys, I do not want you to take away from this conversation we're having now is that it's complicated. Here's the truth, every state is going to be a little different, sometimes even county, right? But at the end of the day, there's people that their jobs rely on us investors not knowing what we're doing when it comes to it, that's why we go to them.

David Olds: Yeah yeah.

David Dodge: So find the people in those areas, they could be title companies, they could be closing attorneys, they maybe a mix of both, right? And let them help you. David said I'm going to have them review my contract. Great, I love that, right? Because maybe there's something that's not gonna fly, let's change it now, let's get it fixed right? But then we're going to hand this to them and they're gonna charge us, it's not gonna be free but that's okay and they're gonna help us facilitate and get the transaction closed and done so we can get paid. I love that.

David Olds: Yeah. So what I tell people is be a good partner, right? So again what's in it for the attorney? Hey you know I do a lot of deals in other markets we're just expanding out to Louisville, I'd love to send my deals your way, here's what we're doing. Are you cool with these types of closings? Because not every title company is the same.

David Dodge: Yup.

David Olds: In that some just- and we have title companies here in town, I know some of the owners they just wanna do $400,000 new builds. Bing bing bing, they're on the easy plan, you know, they wanna deal with realtors, they don't want anything goofy and again our stuff is goofy, right? It's a train wreck sometimes.

David Dodge: Right.

David Olds: You know, there's weird title issues, there's just stuff right? So not every title company will specialize in that so that's why you wanna ask as an investor friendly title company. So if you don't want subject 2, you better ask them right? Cause not every [inaudible].

David Dodge: Not everyone is even gonna know what that is, right.

David Olds: Not everybody wants to do novations, not everybody wants to do owner finance, not everybody wants to wholesale. So tell the attorney, the closing agent, the manager, whoever it is, hey here's what I'm doing, I'm experienced, I'm not an idiot, you know, I'm doing deals and I'd love to run them through your office you know, if you have the bandwidth to handle more business, right? So what's in it for them? So that's crucial and if they're not your guy, they're not your guy, that's okay but there is somebody in every market that will close a wholesale deal.

David Dodge: I love it. So David this is awesome, one of my favorite podcasts that I've done in the last couple months by far because you are filled with a wealth of knowledge, been in the game for a minute but regardless of all that, you're a giver and I love hosting people that give because that's why the people come, that's why the audience comes, they want to learn something. I've learned a couple things on this episode and I've been in the game 17 years so if you are listening to this guys, you have had to have learned several things, probably 10 plus things at this point. Very very cool. David, all things David right is davidoldsrei.com, that's a hub?

David Olds: Yeah go there, that's kind of like a little hub and it'll shoot you off to some of our other businesses and but you know, I've got some free stuff there, bunch of videos, content like this and you know.

David Dodge: So the best place for people to connect with you though is ideally Instagram right?

David Olds: Yeah yeah and again like I answer all my stuff, you know so yeah I'd love to help out in any way that I can.

David Dodge: And then what is easyreiclosing.com? That's- you have sent over some notes for me right? And that one says that this is the premier transaction company for the nationwide wholesalers, right?

David Olds: Yes. So one thing that we've realized there's a gap in the market, right? There's no- there's no gap in the market for CRM's, there's no gap in the market for skip tracers or text blasters but as we've gone and- and I have students too from all over the country that we help you going but one thing that's a problem and so if you think about most entrepreneurs, right? Most of us, anybody that would- that has it in them to go out and start a business, right? Like we're a little manic, we're crazy, we're all over the place, we're like Tasmanian devils, we're talking to people, we're doing stuff, but what's the thing you're worst at probably? Paperwork. I mean it's terrible, paper- like none of us are great at it, I know because my accountant emails me four times to get the same stuff.

David Dodge: Yeah yeah exactly, that's so true.

David Olds: Yeah what we realized is- because people have asked me like do you wanna start a title company? I'm like eh I didn't really want to do that but here's what I can do, I can help you get all of your property- all of your properties closed. So we can be that in between person so instead of you going out and hiring somebody in your office for $40,000, what we'll do is we'll get your transactions closed for you and I'll show you how we'll do it for free. So we have a couple little things that we can do where if you use our contracts the way it's written, the empire will end up paying for that and let us be that service for you. So we're actually launching it in November 1st is the day that it goes live, we're gonna be speaking at a couple of events in Miami and San Antonio but we're staffing up for that now, it's a ton of money to build it out, CRM and all the websites but essentially that's what it is, we will have somebody in our office, we'll have a team of 15 people here that they will talk to you, you'll give us your buying contract, we will reach out to the seller, right? Go find your next deal, let us do that.

David Dodge: I love that.

David Olds: I will go to the- I will go to the seller and I'll say hey Mr. Seller here are the documents I need to get this thing closed. I need to get your leases, I need to get your seller document, your mortgage information, we're gonna do all that gathering right? Because if you're a solo person or you have a small team like you have to stop what you're doing, change hats, okay what do I need for this person right? Well what are you gonna do when the title company starts saying hey we need affidavits and the monumental title and we need all these things, you're gonna be like I don't know right? So you've gotta stop doing income generating activities to go do this, right? So easyreiclosings.com opens you know, we launched it, we're already- we're in soft mode right now with some big wholesalers around the country making sure all of our systems are tight but we're gonna take that, we're gonna take your contract, we'll deal with the seller. Now listen we're gonna tell you hey you need to go do something but you know, we'll handle all that paperwork and we'll be the person between you and the title company. And then when you sell your deal, send us the contract, we'll reach out to the buyer hey Mr. Buyer we need your LLC docs, I need your hard money lender, I need the contact info, I need all of those things right? Because this is that thing where it's like another level of experience where most people don't have it, they either don't have the experience or they don't have somebody in their office that knows how to do it.

David Dodge: Sure.

David Olds: And they don't wanna pay 40 grand.

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: I know it's 40 grand because I've hired people to do this. So you know, we will take care of all that coordinating and the closing, getting everybody together, and let you know hey here's when the closing is happening, you know we use nationwide title companies 'cause the only good thing that came out of COVID was everybody figured out how to do it.

David Dodge: Everybody figured out how to get-how to do- how to do some virtual a little bit more than they already were.

David Olds: [inaudible] on a closing that nobody ever met and nobody came together. So yeah so we will do all that for you, you know, super low amount to become a member of that 'cause you know we're like Sam's Club, we're not gonna make any money on the transaction but you know it's a couple grand to get in there a year and we'll handle all that for you and we're a heck of a lot cheaper than hiring somebody in your office that may or may not know what they're doing.

David Dodge: I love it. Guys David Olds is the man, go follow him on Instagram, check out David Olds, that's D-A-V-I-D O-L-D-S R-E-I Instagram but also the.com, he's got a hub over there for all things. This has been an amazing podcast guys, he just broke down how he has been able to go from one market to 18. I feel like I need to be paying this guy for this coaching that he just gave me but he didn't just give it to me, he gave it to all of us and I am incredibly grateful to get an hour, an hour and a half almost of David's time today and I'm just so grateful to call him a friend. He's an amazing investor, he cares about all of this, all the people here in this investor community and he's the real deal so David thank you so much for coming on. One more question and we're signing off.

David Olds: Yes.

David Dodge: One more. What are- what is- what would you tell a brand new investor, right? That's trying to get in the game? I already know your answer but I want to hear it. What would be your piece of advice for somebody to stop sitting on the sidelines with analysis paralysis thinking well I need to learn you know, a little more, I need to take one more course, I need to- I need to read one more book before I get started. What's your advice?

David Olds: So of course it's take massive action, right? And here's the- here's the analogy that somebody told me once that makes perfect sense. So I'm on the East Coast, I'm in Chattanooga, if I was driving to California and it's dark tonight like I kind of know what direction I'm heading in, there's GPS, I know where my next three turns are.

David Dodge: I love this.

David Olds: Right? But at night I can only see as far as my headlights go, you know? I could see where I'm going, I have faith Siri is not going to screw me.

David Dodge: Yeah I can't see 100 miles or 1000 miles but I can see 100 feet.

David Olds: Right? Like I can [inaudible].

David Dodge: Yeah.

David Olds: I may not know where every potholes at but I just- I just have to take that leap and go take some action, right? So within that, here's the thing that I tell people because I remember, I do remember when I was- when I was first starting. If you've heard me on any other podcast I'll talk about how I went to this REIA and I was afraid to go in.

David Dodge: Oh no.

David Olds: I drove to [inaudible], and I went home and told my wife oh I just couldn't find it. It was in Orlando [inaudible]. So people never believe that, I'm like it's the truth so I understand being new, right? So that's why I'm like I wanna over deliver and over- because I remember what it was like to be in the room at a REIA or at a meetup and I was afraid to go over and talk to the guys who was doing-

David Dodge: That's why I asked this question 'cause this is valuable.

David Olds: I'm freaking petrified, right? So I understand that and I wanna always give because I remember that feeling like I told you I'm an introverted person at my core and you know, I would- the family reunion last week I'm still kind of standing there 'cause these are all like these big coaches and it's really cool but everybody was awesome. So anyways, but the other thing, the other piece of advice besides take massive action is when we're starting with your guy or gal, you feel like you're on an island right? You're all alone, you're stranded on this island, you're working hard, right? You're watching videos, you bought a course and you're listening to it but you're working on your kitchen table and you're trying to do this but it feels like you're the only person in the world doing this business. You just- you know, it's lonely, I'm telling you being an entrepreneur can be hard but the way that you combat that, right? Is get around the campfire with other people.

David Dodge: Love it.

David Olds: So go to a REIA, right? Go to a REIA, go to a meet up. If there isn't one, go on meetup.com, post something.

David Dodge: Find them, Facebook, meetup.com, boom that's it you're gonna find the people that are getting together and meeting and they're talking about a similar thing: real estate investing.

David Olds: Yeah. You know hey you know I'm an investor, I'm gonna be at Panera every Wednesday from 8 to 9, love to network, you'll get people there. Then post the pictures, hey ten of us got together, you know create the group and you don't have to be this crazy outgoing Brent Daniels guy to do that, right? You could be being very lowkey but get around people that are doing deals, right? And don't be jealous of them right? Embrace their success. You know I was, you know, my morning's crazy like we signed a $55,000 deal but I also had one that might go south for 10 grand right? So I was in one of my offices and I'm like man what am I gonna do to fix this and I got a call from my buddy in San Antonio, Carlos Hernandez which you guys should be following and he's like- he's like hey how's it going? I'm like ah a little bit of a tough morning, he's like oh I won't tell you. I'm like what's going on? He's like I just did like this $49,000 deal, I'm like dude I wanna hear that because your success is my success. You know I care about me just a hair more than you do like I need to feed off of that right? So get around other people that are doing stuff maybe at a higher level and just feed off that energy and you just have to know in your core that this is doable, other people are doing it, you know, borrow that confidence if you need to. Go out and do the business but get around people that are doing it. There's a whole big community of people out there, there's great Facebook pages, find somebody that's local, go meet him for lunch man, hear what they're doing, maybe they're doing something different, right? I have friends that do storage units and apartment buildings and mobile homes and I just-

David Dodge: All kinds of cool stuff.

David Olds: I just want to hear what you're doing man, I'm fascinated by it you know and some people wanna hear what I'm doing for whatever reason and yeah just get around some people and just borrow that excitement and that's the stuff that gets you through the- through the tough days.

David Dodge: Man I love it. David, thank you so much again for coming on this show. Guys don't forget check him out on Instagram davidoldsrei or go to davidoldsrei.com. His takeaway was take massive action, get out there and be around the people that are taking massive action. If you're on the sidelines, go watch those people, get with them, network with them, be in the room with them and before you know it some of their expertise, some of their confidence is going to rub off on you and then before you know it you're going to be taking massive action just like they are. Amazing. David, thank you so much for coming on. Guys don't forget: you make your money when you buy, you get paid when you sell. Signing off.

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